My column today on Jimmy Clausen and how unfit he is to be the Panthers' long-term quarterback has drawn, at last count, 225 comments, which isn't the most a story of mine has ever gotten but has to be in my personal top 10 all-time.
I've also gotten some e-mails asking questions about the column, and I'll respond to 3 of them here:
Q: Are you saying Clausen shouldn't be a Panther at all in 2011?
A: No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying he should be a backup. I think he could do that job adequately, but I think we've seen enough now to know he will never be an elite NFL starter and possibly never an adequate one, either. Certainly, he is pretty terrible right now.
Q: Should the Panthers start Brian St. Pierre now? Or Armanti Edwards?
A: No and no. I agree with John Fox, who says he doesn't anticipate a change at this point.
BSP certainly isn't the long-term guy here -- might as well give Clausen the work, because he needs all the reps he can get. And Edwards? I'd like to see him with 4-8 plays in the shotgun "Mountaineer" formation next week, absolutely, but he is ill-equipped to be an NFL starter at this point because he has been playing WR most of the year.
Q: What about Cam Newton? Shouldn't the Panthers draft him if Andrew Luck decides to return to Stanford for his junior year (but Newton, a junior, declares early as expected)?
A: I don't see why not. As I wrote today, I think the Panthers have to take a QB with their first pick, because that's the NFL's most important position (and it's not close), and they don't have their QB of the future on the roster right now.
We're moving!
9 years ago
Posts
46 comments:
Do the Panthers trade down if Andrew Luck is not available and take a QB later in the 1st round?
Scott,
I'm pleased for you that you have been living in your fantasy world of being a faux sportswriter so long that you actually believe you are qualified to evaluate NFL talent! With all of the issues going on with the Panthers at this point in time you, nor anyone else, can fairly and adequately evaluate Clausen and claim he should not be the starter next year and maybe not even a QB at all.
Clausen starting the next 3 games is a sure bet...means we won't need luck to have Luck on our side.
OK Scott, let me give you two rookie receivers and a tight end that is not fitted for a passing offense (jeff King) and then evaluate a Rookie quarterback. Did Carson Palmer light it up his rookie year? or Peyton Manning? or Matthew Stafford? or Ben Roethlisberger (he had a defense and solidified recievers with Cowher). I think this is the most retarded articler ever.
I hope someone mugs clausen this offseason. He isn't fit to lead line of rats out of town. He is that jerk that no one respects including the fans. He just is not a leader and i'm glad Smith called him out.
Wow, I can't believe I am in the position of defending Jimmy Clausen. But I think it is columns like this one, Scott, that destroyed Kerry Collins' chances in Charlotte many years ago ... and he went on to a fine NFL career and is still playing.
OK, Clausen may never work out. But I guarantee you that if Andy Reid were his coach, we would be talking him up as rookie of the year.
Clausen is caught in a VERY bad offensive system, with crappy play calling, will very poor pass blocking by the offensive line, with a coach that doesn't believe in him, with no veteran leader to help him along, and with a crabby, selfish wide receiver who yells at him on the sideline.
Clausen shouldn't even be playing this season. He should be watching from the sideline, learning and building confidence. Just like Kerry Collins should have.
Collins ended up being a good QB, and it is possible that Clausen could, too. I agree we haven't seen much yet. I give 50% of the blame to a horrible offensive coaching staff.
Scott is 110% correct. This is by far the NFL's most important position. That's why the best teams always have elite QB's. Clausen is HORRIBLE! Anyone with football knowledge knows this. Bring in Mr. Luck and bring Harbaugh with him.
i agree he shold start that way we know we are going to lose and get the number one pick of the next draft
Cam Newton will be an awful pro. You're not a scout and neither am I so our opinion is about equal.
If they don't take Luck they should not take quarterback. Especially not Cam Newton.
I don't think Clausen will be the answer for this team but In agree that he was put in a terrible position. Where to start, horrible head coaching but even worse offensive coordinator, the worst in the NFL by a long stretch. No WRs and that includes the aging #89 who SHOULD HAVE BEEN TRADED!! Any lies that come out of Hurney's filthy mouth about rebuilding this team end here b/c he just can't explain why the Panthers haven't traded Smith esp considering they gave away a 2nd rder for AE!!! This reminds me the Chargers when they had Drew Brees who they thought he wasn't the answer and they picked Rivers, the Panthers can do the same and draft Luck, who has too much upside for the Cats to pass on. Plus apparently the only way they could draft him is probably by hiring Harbaugh and that will be great hire my friends. Mr. Richardson if u really want Panthers fans -and not just PSL owners- you MUST fire Hurney tomorrow!
Funny how Scott isn't throwing Fox and the lame duck coaches under the bus. Does he have a love affair with them?
Funny before the year started he stated Clausen will be the best passer to put on a Panthers uniform. Now after 7 games he will never amount to being an elite QB but a back up.
I wouldn't be surprise if the same is said with Luck as well. When has Fox ever develop a QB and WR that was drafted? Never
It sure doesn't help having the worst offensive coordinator and QB coach combo in the league. Which no player would have success under them.
A head coach who is conservative with his run 1st,pass 2nd, and play good defense. He must doesn't know the league has change to pass happy.
Along handcuffs offensive and defensive coordinators. Put Clausen is a Eagles, Saints, Patriots, or Colts you don't think he would have success? Clearly he would.
How will hiring Jim H be a great deal? He doesn't have coaching experience at the nfl level even though he played 15 years in the league.
If it's to bring Luck sure it would be good. But how many college coaches besides Jimmy J had success in both the nfl and college? None.
Never believed in Clausen...only had hope because I'm a Panther fan. Showed up for his college signing day in a Hummer limo, who does that? Notre Dame wasn't a winner, just a stat stuffer - and that's under a great offensive mind like Charlie Weis. Here...he hasn't improved at all. Two Words - Sam Bradford. Two more - Colt McCoy. Like Jimmy they have good running games - I'd wager we get the edge. Like them, we have no name wide receivers, except we have Steve Smith who is not a no name by any stretch so again we have the edge. Unlike these guys he has no winner in him - no swag. He has fake confidence, he thinks success is owed to him, that's why he showed in the hummer - like he was the prize. That's his mentality - he has a no reality to get used to and if he can get over it he may make it, but we can't put our bet on that.
3 Things we need to do:
We're rebuilding so,
1) Get Luck, if no luck take Newton. Newton has an arm and can at least make plays with his feet behind an injured O-line. Most importantly,both Luck and Newton play with resolve, you will not bend their will to win no matter who the coordinator is....
2) Smitty has value, trade him and get picks (and b/f we say Smitty is done - lets acknowledge that he's had no one to throw it to him for two years - his career/talents dying on a vine. receivers can't throw it to themselves) I would like to see him play for a winner
3) Goodson has shown himself to have value, again trade him and get a pick(s)
oh and colt went toe to toe with PIT and beat NYJ and NE before getting hurt for the season.....that fake confidence will get you every time.
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Scott gets paid to say what he wants, even if he has no clue what he is talking about. Even the best coach in the league and the best rookie QB ever wouldn't do anything on the Panthers. There is very little talent on the team right now, I guess that is what happens when you gut a team.
Right on about Clausen starting with Edwards and an enhanced Mountaineer package for a change of pace and style.
So 7 games in his rookie year, and the mighty Scott Fowler can determine that Clausen will never be anything more than a backup his entire NFL career. What if this same standard was held to Troy Aikman?
"There is very little talent on the team right now, I guess that is what happens when you gut a team".
Your forgetting the most important thing and that is coaching. I always hear how great of a coach Fox is but he hasn't prove to be.
Bill B can find anybody off the street from other team trash and turn them into solid players. He also can adjust. Game plan along develop talent.
Bill B could win with thie very few talents on a roster.
Scott,
Please help us to put things into perspective, what is the record for consecutive losses for a rookie starting quarterback?
SCOTT YOU AND SORENSOLN KNOW VERY LITTLE ABOUTL PRO FOOTBALL. AFTER WATCHJING ONE TO 2 QURARTERS OF PANTHER FOOTBALL I HAVE COME TO LLTHE CONCUSION THAT THE PAN THER ORGANIZATION HAS NO DRAFT PLAN TO GET STAR COLLLEGE PLAUERS. JOE MONTANA IN HIS PRIME COOULD NOT PLAU FOR THE PANTHER OFFENSEL RULE NO 1 GET OFFENSIVE LINE IN PLACE , RULE NO 2 , GET DEFENSE LINE, RULE NO 3 GET BLOCKING WIDE RECEIVERS, AND THEN GET A QUARTERBACK TO GIVE HIM 3.9 SEC. TO THROW THE BALL,AND ON 3RD DOWN AND LONG GET A COACH ENOUGH SENSE NOT TO RUN THE BALL .THIS OFFESNSIVE PLAYS REMING ME OF CLEVELAND PLAYS YEARS AGO . HOW MANY WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS HAVE CLEVELAND HAS WON LUCK IS NOT THE ANSWER OR NEWTON UNTIL RICHARDSON GETS THJE MINDSET TO GET PLAYERS HUNGRY TO PLAY AND SHELL OUT THE MONEY I PREDICTED BEFORE THE SEASON THAT THE PANTHERS WOULD WIN 1 GAME AND I KNOW FOOTBALL AFTER 60 YEAARS ;
What is the record for consecutive losses for a rookie starting quarterback?
Did Cris W lose 15 straight games as a starting rookie QB?
Scott, as I said in my comment on your column, I think you're way out of line on this one. I think we're all at a consensus that Clausen doesn't look good. The Panthers as a whole look pretty lousy, too. I just think it's harsh and unfair to judge him on his play under this coaching scheme, with second-tier talent on a team riddled with injuries. Tom Brady, Peyton Manning or Philip Rivers couldn't even save this bunch, though I do doubt they'd look as bad as Clausen.
Give Jimmy a decent coaching staff, strong OL, the existing RB combo, a TE who can actually catch, and a couple studs at WR, and I think you'd see a completely different QB. I hope you're on the chat today so you can defend your nonsense.
If Luck is not available, I would take Cam Newton, Ryan Mallet, Jake Locker, etc. All of them are already better than Clausen. I would also trade Stewart to get some additional draft picks to try to get help at the DT position (get one who can put pressure on the QB, and stuff the run).
the "don't take cam newton" contingent in these comments all have zero clue about the earth we live on and they should all drown or at least make sure they don't contribute to the gene pool. newton is going to be the best QB anyone has ever seen.
Cowardly yellow Tom Sorensen now uses kid gloves to try to gently reprimand Steve Smith after another assault on a teammate only verbal assault this time?
Laughble. Smith has sucked for 2 years now hasnt he and even said he sucked as a non-factor 2 yrs ago. Nothing has changed.
Andrew Luck? Why are all these idiots jumping on him when they dont even know who he is. Luck has only played TWO years of college football? He is sophomore. Why would be leave? You think a sophomore can change it all? Laughble.
Newton? Daddy would sell him in a heartbeat we know and already is but what about the baggage and cheating? Yes he was innocent? Laughable.
Prepare for the a second 1-15 season in 8 years and maybe next year and the next.
Major overhaul needed. Rebuild from the ground up. It will take 5 yrs unless you hire all vets like in 1995.
Jerry is just estatic he invented PSLs or he would be broke long ago.
Newton is good but they are making him out to be a one man show in typical egotistical fashion. Same ole story. Man for man Auburn is by far the best team in college football and half the NFL.
Weapons everywhere. No weaknesses yet here come the ego Cammie maniacs trying to make him to be a one man team. What a joke.
Newton had his best pass game against South Carolina who has never won the SEC. No big feat. His pass game is mediocre and he def wont run over anybody in the NFL. NFL LBs will eat him for a light snack and carry him away on a stretcher like Vick who thought he could run.
Here's an image: 212 yards rushing by the RBs last Sunday and Clausen can't pull off a play action fake!?! See Clausen tripping over his feet, falling to the ground when just trying to hand the ball off. He is JV people!
He fell into our lap, teams were not targeting him in the draft. Pick Luck or Newton and start again - that's what you do when you rebuild - you start again with a quarterback. Newton would add to an already dangerous backfield and Luck can flat out play and scramble. There is no threat of our QB making a play unless Davidson drew up, Jimmy can't improvise.
Popular opinion aside, this team isn't that bad...good RBs, decent WRs and a defense that stays on the field too long. Its not a bad car, but it needs a driver. Again, name the Rams and Browns wide receivers...nothing (except the homeboy Massaquoi). Sam Bradford and Colt McCoy are competent "drivers", playmakers if you will or at least make few mistakes. AND their teams play for them, that has nothing to do with the skill around him, the playcalling - nothing. That's all on Jimmy. Cam may cheat but he obviously must be a leader cause other than "Rudy" I've never seen a college player carried off the field by his fellow players. Clausen never saw the field from that vantage point at ND
Here are just four quarterbacks with ratings similar to Clausen there rookie season:
Aikman 55.7
E.Manning 55.4
McNabb 60.1
Vick 62.7
Furthermore, think about all the first round quarterbacks that are complete busts:
Ryan Leaf
Akili Smith
Andre Ware
Chris Weinke
Right now Clausen could fall into either category. It is impossible to accurately predict. I am not saying he is the next Aikman nor the next Leaf. There are too many other things wrong with this team to get an accurate asssessment of his performance. I think the biggest tell will be how he acts in the off season. To see if he takes a step back and takes a look at his faults and works to fix them. This season, and how Clausen handles it in the aftermath, can define his career. This season is a turning point to being a good quarterback or one as a turning point to mediocrity and failure.
I hope Clausen proves all the critics wrong and becomes the best quarterback of all time and wins 10Superbowls with the Panthers. Of course I do not truly believe he can win 10 Superbowls, but I do believe he can be a good QB. Regardless of what happens with Clausen, I will be a Panthers fan forever. If people want to jump off the bandwagon, that’s ok with me. I will be here when you decide to jump back on.
Weinke was not a bust.
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Even if you end up taking Luck (or Newton), you have to at least shop the #1 pick to see if anyone bites. We have too many needs all over the field to take the moonshot at a franchise QB in the top spot. If it fails, we're right back where we started.
If we could drop back to #6-7 and pick up 3 more picks in the top 4 rounds, it would be worth it. I'd rather take a top-notch DT, which is usually less of a crap shoot than a QB, and get Kellen Moore in the second round.
Does anyone remember that Clausen is not 100%? He has 2 torn ligaments in the foot that he gets all of his power from. I am sure that is affecting his scrambling ability and his ability to go downfield. And I am sure there is a great deal of pain involved. It is funny how that was left out of Scott's article yesterday.
@dec. 14 at 10:58 a.m
chris weinke wasnt drafted in the first round, i think it was the fourth!!!!!
Scott,
I may be out of line by saying anything since I am sickened by the idea that paid men can't do better than 1-12 even with what seems like a team full of nobodies minus a couple of players. I think the best quarter back has set the sidelines all year long. Armanti Edwards can do what none of the others can do and thats run the ball as well. Many people say oh its his size well go back to the likes of Doug Flutie and Ted Marchibroda, heck even Michael Vick is only 5'11". Take a look at the App. St. victory over Michigan watch that and see the size of guys Edwards was around. The problem here is that we have a coaching staff that only thinks with the right side of their brain. At this point I know its about the number one draft pick but I would bet with what we had starting the seasons with healthy backs and receivers this young man would have picked apart defences just as Vick is doing. Well I guess we will never know I do hope someone picks him up and gives him the oppurtunity to show himself so that this coaching staff can walk around kicking themselves.
Does anyone know what Jimmy Johnson said about Jimmy Clausen during halftime on Fox? I was at the game and didn't record the show but understand he made some comment.
not that you'd ever hear the sports media machine talk about it. unfortunately 2010 salary figures aren't available yet, but I know peppers is getting more than $20 mil this year.
2010 stats: Julius Peppers: 44 tackles, 3 forced fumbles, 8 sacks, 11 stops for loss, 2009 salary $16,683,000
2010 stats: Charles Johnson: 54 tackles, 1 forced fumble, 8.5 sacks, 13 stops for loss 2009 salary $465,720
Johnson said the Panthers get Luck in the draft.
I agree, at this point seems like you Scott are on the Luck's agent payroll. I mean, ok you don't like Clausen, but WHY oh WHY you write about drafting a QB that at this point is the same as Clasuen was in the draft. If you remember, some had Clausen as the 1º pick cause he was the most pro ready of all Qb's.
If you're gonna say QB is the most important position, why not make an article about all the pro QB's that are gonna be free agents at the end of the season and how they would fit in the Panthers.
Why not put Smith at QB and see how good he can do?
"get Kellen Moore in the second round".
Kellen M already stated he is returning for his senior year, so he isn't coming out. Even if he did unless he turns out to be Steve Y I say draft him. If not then hell no
I think Jimmy is in the wrong offense to be successful. He doesn't have the arm for play action offenses which require deep passes with touch and a fast delivery. I think he would probably do well in a west coast style offense.
So I am not ready to write him off as a pro but barring a real philosophy change I don't think his future is here. And I don't think he's our future either.
With that said before we try our Luck I think we should pay a lot of attention to pros who may be available.
A big part of playing QB is confidence and swagger. Clausen is too meek to be the leader, he clearly lacks the charisma required to be better than average. And his skill level is not very impressive either.
He is not a fighter, name a play from this season that you looked at and thought "Wow Clausen really did something there." I can only think of the throw to Gettis at the end of the Browns game and it was a much better catch then pass.
An earlier comment mentioned some notables that had similar QB ratings as rookies. But I bet they showed some promise at some point that we are not seeing from Clausen at all. Maybe those ratings were a result of INT's offsetting TD's. Clausen can't score but he does show up on the turnover stats every week.
If it looks like dogs#$&t and smells like it, then it must be...
I don't get how you guys in Charlotte are so in love with luck?!! He is not a better qb than newton, and will not be a big a threat ad newton on the field. The only thing newton had done for any team he's played for in college is win, and win big!! The ONLY reason I hope someone else gets newton is if the same coaching staff stays with the panthers offensively. He (newton) has too much to offer to be wasted on fox, davidson and whoever the qb coach is. One other thing about this love for luck you guys have, wasn't the same thing said about clausen last year? He equipped for the NFL because of the system he's coming from... Look where that got the panthers. Panthers, do the SMART thing!!!
I actually almost agree with Fowler this time. However, I want to see how Newton plays in this championship game. I'm beginning to think he may develop into a better quarterback than Luck. I think Luck should be a good quarterback, but Newton's potential looks limitless.
I was refering to Weinke being a heisman winner and then being a bust in the NFL. We all know that judging talent in the NFL is like picking a mutual fund. Past performance is one of the best indicators but past performance does not indicate future performance.
I think Clausen has had moments where he has looked promising. The problem is he has laid an egg more often than showed the few flashes of promise. I am still undecided about him but I do hold out hope that he will be a good QB.
I am sure after the terrible seasons Aikman, E.Manning, and McNabb had there rookie seasons there were fans yelling for there respective teams to go out and draft the latest and greatest. Imagine what would have happened had those teams actually given up on them instead of developing them.
That is a word that is not spoken here in Carolina in regards to a QB. Develope. Clausen should never have started this year. He should have been treated like a red shirt freshman and just watched film as well as the game and practiced. Like I said before, I think the off season will speak volumes of Clausen as a future NFL QB.
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