Tuesday, December 18, 2012

Perturbed Panther fans Part 2

If you didn't see the full-page advertisement in Monday's Charlotte Observer sports section that was very critical of team owner Jerry Richardson and coach Ron Rivera, you can see the original story about that ad right here.

The ad inspired a lot of debate on both sides. Incidentally, I wrote in today's newspaper that I believe Rivera should be given one more year by Richardson, but that he should be fired following the 2013 season if he doesn't make the playoffs.

Some have praised the ad for its bluntness. Some have criticized it for its anonymous nature. Today, I received the following email from the "Perturbed Panther" fans who wrote the original ad (so they say), and I am reprinting their email on this blog in full without additional comments so you can judge it for yourself. Feel free to leave your own comments about their email below.

Scott:

I've been asked to contact the Observer on behalf of a large number of Panther fans (many not PSL owners) regarding the reaction to the open letter to Mr. Richardson that was in yesterday's paper.

It seems some media outlets are more interested in the names of the many dissatisfied and demoralized fans in Panther land, or the cost of the ad itself, rather than in the heart and soul of our message.

First, this is not about whining, money, different classes of fans or anything personal between us and Jerry Richardson or Ron Rivera. Both seem like nice gentlemen, but we don't know them personally and that is not the point.

What this is simply about is unacceptable RESULTS and the extreme frustration felt by so many of us by the failure of Mr. Richardson, or to some respect, many of Charlotte's media outlets, to address this perennial dilema openly, honestly and thoroughly. We fans are happy to pay for entertainment and know there will be up and down years in any professional sports franchises history but the Panthers' results are borderline embarassing and we think we fans and the Carolinas deserve a better effort instead of that old bromide about repeating the same thing year-after-year and expecting better results.

At the end of the day, four winning seasons (and none consecutively) in 18 years is indisputable and kind of says it all. This record, by definition, simply cannot be reflective of effective ownership/management of this or any professional franchise. Then we wonder why a former highly competitive professional athlete and successful businessman would tolerate repeated mediocrity or embarassment. The only answer we can come up with is money. If personal net worth is going up tens of millions of dollars a year, human nature suggests it is awfully difficult to get too upset about the core endeavor that is generating such wealth. Put another way, if the Panthers performance on the field were generating out-of-pocket losses each year, would Mr. Richardson's sense of urgency and efforts to turn things around be as understated?

Scott, the NFL "business trade" is simple: Community gets behind wealthy owner(s) to get franchise established; Once franchise granted,owner virtually guaranteed escalating wealth by the league and parity provisions; Community receives direct and indirect economic stimulation; Fans pay up for right to be entertained and engender pride in franchise and greater community; Team performs at level adequate to sustain the preceeding benefits at highest levels.

The only element of the trade here in Charlotte that has not been delivered is the last one, which happens to be the only "pay back" for us fans. When critics of our letter say we're a bunch of whiners who, if we don't like how things are going, should sell our licenses and/or tickets, our response is: WE DON'T WANT TO QUIT! WE LOVE OUR TEAM AND OUR COMMUNITY! WE WANT THIS OWNERSHIP TO WAKE UP AND DELIVER ON THEIR END OF THE BARGAIN! That is the point we are trying to deliver to the media and Mr. Richardson. Who are we? We are the heart and soul of the Panthers; their most loyal (and demoralized) fans.

We have taken the time and chipped in some money to go public with our views and open the fact-based discussion. We get criticized for speaking our mind and remaining anonymous. Everyone knows who Mr. Richardson is but,with rare exception, he chooses to stay silent. Which do you think is worse.

You guys in the media take the torch from here. Pressure Mr. Richardson to lay-out a specific and plausible turn-around plan. We have done our part and hope you will help get this ownership to deliver on theirs.

Respectfully, TRUE PANTHER FANS EVERYWHERE!

76 comments:

Anonymous said...

Well said.

Anonymous said...

Bravo and amen to these pissed off fans. 'tis better in my book to make your frustrated voice be heard, even if anonymously, than to stay silent whilst counting the cash that's flooding in.

Ben said...

I for one am thankful they stepped up and lodged some criticism in a public forum. I understand what some people have complained about, but then again, maybe the attitude conveyed by the people complaining about the ad is also to blame for the lack of progress with this team.

Too many "fans" are willing to settle for the mediocrity we have had on the field for the last 4 years. They finger point at anyone who criticizes the team, calling them out as "fairweather". We saw plenty of posts from them the last 24 hours, telling people they should sell their tickets if they arent happy, etc. Yet, not calling out glaring problems with this team is making the problem worse. Without pressure from ticket buyers, this situation will continue. So, maybe those who settle for mediocrity by refusing to call out management and the coaches/players should also consider they are to blame. Standing by silently never fixes anything.

Anyone who cares about this team is not "whining", but rather, asking the team to improve. Whether you agree or not with the ad, it will get the conversation going, and if the team improves, all the people on here complaining about the ad and calling these guys out will be the first ones to praise the changes.

At the end of the day, if the team improves, wins, and brings home the title, will anyone care whether or not this ad or the people who criticized it get the results? No. We are all after the same thing - a better team and a title. The people who printed the ad have every right to say what they said and call people out, just as those who criticize themj have the right to criticize. But lets not lose sight of the bigger goal, Panthers fans - a Superbowl Title.

Anonymous said...

Even if Mr Richardson decides to pull the plug on the coaching staff, you are still looking at two to three more years of losing. It will take at least that much time for a new coach with a different approach to win. Give Rivera at least one or two more years to bring this team around. The revolving door of coaching will only lead to more losing seasons.

Anonymous said...

I'm amazed at how impatient Panther fans are. The Pats were terrible for 40 years, now they're great. At least the Panthers have put together some good seasons. Pittsburgh Pirates fans finally had a good team after a 20 year drought. Same with the Orioles. The Lions stink year in and year out.

While there are plenty of good reasons to criticize specific moves in terms of players and coaches, Richardson fired the last head coach, he got rid of his GM and they changed special teams coaches this year. They've signed some pretty good players over the years from Steve Smith to Cam Newton.

Sorry, but you can't win every year and having a few years of a dry stretch isn't reason to turn on the home town team.

Anonymous said...

Good for these guys. Why are they 'terrible fans' if they want their team to succeed? Saying that they should just get rid of their seats if they don't like the product does nothing to IMPROVE the product. Put a plan in place that fans can get behind, Mr. Richardson!

SCOTTisWRONGagain said...

I am glad at least the CO decided to post this email. I have been screaming the same for years. Scott is convinced the Panthers are a really good team that has really bad luck. We who know the game see it for what it is, a team in shambles. My fear is until the Big Rat is past, this team is what it is, bad.

Anonymous said...

I've always thought Jerry Richardson was the major blockade in repeat success of the Panthers seasons. Now it is proven; he fired both sons, then the General Manager and the head coach (How is John Fox doing today? He's winning!). The whole team was changed to mostly younger players. Why? because of money! Why has anything not been changed to produce multiple winning seasons? Because of money! The Big (Fat) Cat is stubborn and wants to be rich instead of wise! I've always thought this since the '96 season.

Anonymous said...

Although I am not a PSL owner, which is partly due to the lack of a winning seasons, I can feel their pain. When you're spending that kind of money and have love for your team you view it as an investment and as well you should. When you're giving the panthers organization your money, your time, and your emotions you expect results. Some people may want their results in wins, community support, or by having an organization that visabbly tries. Based on my own opinion it would appear that the only result I am seeing is the community support. So for all of those out there that didn't agree with the ad taken out by a group of PSL owners, just remember that when you invest money, time, or emotions into something you expect results so why shouldn't the PSL owners expect the same.

Anonymous said...

Ready, aim, fire--shoot the messenger. The article was well thought out and on point. This attitude of if don't like it move on, don't forget Panthers, they are taxpayers too.

Anonymous said...

Lots of money clogs the regular thought process! Why change if money is rolling in!!!

steven said...

I totally agree with the people who wrote this. Jerry will not spend money to make this team better. He goes and signs three rbs to a bunch of money but don't have any to spend on other positions we need. That's DUMB and we need more veteran's to help the younger players. But no he wants to just put all young players in there. Also, you get rid of your all-time kicker because of money, and sign some cheap kicker. All signs point to him putting money in his pocket and not the team. And by the way he brought in a cheap head coach. Jerry is not running a good organization right now, that's the truth. We need to make the playoffs consecutive years, and make this team better instead of just making it by and losing every year. So I totally agree with the ad, and no one has to put there name on a ad put in the paper Scott.

A Real Fan said...

Wow. What a sense of entitlement. Not winning? It must mean the owner and management isn't committed to winning. Outside of a couple of real stinker seasons, the results over the entire tenure of the Panthers' existense has been good to mediocre. Do I really need to list the teams over that time period that have been worse? I get that fans are tired of mediocrity and want a winner. I also believe that the ownership wants the same. I truly believe that was one of the biggest factors in blowing up the team before the lockout season. The team was mired in mediocrity and I don't fault Mr. Richardson for not wanting to waste a lot of money going into a lockout situation. Sometimes you have to get worse before you get better. Unfortunately in the fantasy football world of armchair owners, management and coaches, the answer is very simple - throw money at a big name coach and free agents. I defy any of you to show me an example of this working. In your open letter you reference the Patriots, but when Belichick was hired the fans were outraged. He was labeled a failure in Cleveland. How did that turn out? Show me where they spend on big name free agents - oh wait, they don't. Neither do the Steelers, the Giants, or the Packers. On the other hand, the Jets, Cowboys, Redskins and (more recently the Eagles) have gone that road and to what end? Has the management of the Panthers made mistakes in personnel? Absolutely - glaring ones that cost first a coach and now a GM their jobs. Are we ridiculously loyal to certain players? Yes, but that doesn't seem to be the crux of the argument you make. Outside of one season the Panthers have never seemed hesitant to spend money - they just spent it poorly too often. It has been proven time and again that consistent player development builds consistent winning. From the pit that the team was in, it is far too early to tell if they are on the road to correcting that. I would say signs are encouraging - you may disagree, but again, not the crux of your complaint. Your main issue seems to be that you purchased PSLs and now are unhappy that Mr. Richardson makes a LOT of money off this team, but the team doesn't win. I think the casual link here is flawed. What I get from your letter is that you feel you should have more influence into team management because you own PSLs. The problem is, you are NOT investors in the team, regardless of how you see it. You bought into the PSL with no promise of anything other than the right to buy season tickets. The rules have been clear from the beginning. The idea that you are somehow harmed or cheated is laughable. You pay for the right to attend a football game. If you truly believe that the ownership doesn't care about winning, yet you still purchase the tickets year after year then it is YOU repeating the same behavior over and over expecting different results. You act as if you are trapped into buying the tickets or you cannot recoup your "investment" in the PSL. If you view your seat license as anything more than a right to buy entertainment (much less as an ivestment) then you are deluding yourselves. Would you hold on to any other investment for so long if it underperformed as badly as you say this one has? I doubt it. As a fan from inception who is not a PSL holder, you come across as a bunch of whiny, entitled, arrogant brats. Most of us regular fans only wish we could afford to blow the amount of money you did on this ad for something so frivolous. What do you hope to accomplish? The idea that your whining will influence ownership at all just proves your arrogance and sense of entitlement.

Greg S said...

Sounds like a little backtracking to me. First you accused JR of not caring about winning, now you are back peddling because your ad was not well thought out. I feel that JR has probably been too nice to his employee's over the years, hence keeping Hurney around so long. JR "drank the Kool-aid" Hurney was making. The firing of Hurney, in my opinion, shows that JR is done with mediocrity. I think Rivera deserves one more year. It has been a learning process for this teamm, Rivera and the whole coaching staff. Rivera has made mistakes but he stikes me as a man who learns the best that way. He strikes me as a man who quickly will recognize what to do in certain high pressure situations moving forward. I think his first 2 years was him understanding what his role is as a Head Coach rather than a Defensive Coordinator. As a result of JR firing Hurney, that was the signal Rivera needed to say, "ok I've had enough OTJ training" I know how I want my team coached from both sides and I won't take less than I expect from my Coaches or players. Rivera is finally getting it. And if you really think the Panthers were gonna win more than 9 games this year, I have some ocean front property to sell you in Arizona.

Anonymous said...

We as fans are all very frustrated that this year's team did not meet expectations and "make the playoffs". We were in every game this year for the exception of one. Mr. Richardson brought the NFL to Charlotte and gave us the opportunity to cheer for a team here locally. You stated you wanted to bring in a coach with a winning track record and that Mr. Richardson would not move forward because the top coaches demanded too much money. I guess you forgot that he hired and paid George Siefert many years ago? How did that work out? In my opinion we did not make the playoffs this year because we turned the ball over in the first half of the year and our defense did not commit turnovers. The second half of the year has been quite different. YES, I do think Mr. Richardson waited too long to get rid of Marty Hurney. He should have been cut loose several years ago. Mr. Richardson has hired a consultant and a respectful one at that, to help land the right GM moving forward. This is the first right step. The new GM needs to be given the power to make decisions on the correct players to bring in and that would include through the draft and Free Agency. We missed the boat this year in terms of not signing a corner or wide receiver and that is something we must do for next season. We need a few more leaders on this team and that will come from maturity as well. (Johnson, Kuechly even Cam)
Let's see how the next two weeks pan out. If we go 2-0 and knock off Oakland and the Saints, than I do believe Rivera may deserve another year. Hopefully next year we can start off like we finished this year but it will also take the players to continue playing like they did at the end of this season. Again thank you Mr. Richardson for fighting to get Charlotte an NFL Team!!

Anonymous said...

I simply don't get what people are after here. Do you want him to publicly grovel for not winning? Who does that help, exactly? Do you think there's a magical coach who wins all the time if you only put enough money in front of him? We've always spent well on free agents except for the cash dump year, is there some magical player you think needs to be signed that will make us win all the time? He fired Hurney for you jackals, are you looking to make hiring recommendations (and please, can we stop mythologizing Bill Polian?! The man drafted Payton, good for him, move on)? Richardson's not meddling like Snyder or Jerry Jones, he spends on what his coaches and GM ask him to spend on, he's a leader among the other owners and our franchise is among the most respected in the league (even if not so much among sports writers). I don't see what the problem is. This is a man who desperately wants to win, but has run into the realities of starting up a franchise and some stupid bad luck through the years. For him to be beaten up by his uninformed fanbase who obviously have too much time and money on their hands is the real embarrassment here. You say you love the Panthers so much, how about you get behind the team we actually have here and stop stamping your foot because we don't have the one from your dreams. That way, when we really hit our stride, you can say you've been there all along! You can just leave out the part about how you were dragging us down the whole time...

Anonymous said...

These guys sound like the type that just want Richardson to hire a big-name, expensive coach just for the sake of the name.

Do they realized that Richardson fired the general manager in the middle of the season this year? Yet they think he's just sitting at home watching his bank account without doing anything to try to change the team's fortune?

I'm with Scott Fowler - give Rivera one more season. Playoffs or bust. Starting over now with someone who wants to clean house would just set the team back unnecessarily. We have a good foundation. Give Rivera another year to build it up.

Steve said...

Who cares who they are. They have stated and quite accurately that we have had a sub-par team for most of the life of the organization. Of course I support my team win or lose, but if winning wasn't an issue at all then why have playoffs, or the Super Bowl. All fans hope and wish their team to do well and be great. If injuries or issues beyond the teams control cause losing then we are fine with that. It is when their is a lack of leadership, direction, and an ability to accept a culture of losing that makes us angry.

Anonymous said...

Who is this letter from. Doesn't look like it is signed by anyone. How do we know they are really Panther fans.

C.Bax said...

I agree 100%. It's time to hold Jerry Richardson accountable once and for all!!!!

Hunkydory said...

If the whiner comment came from a blog group called "Cat Scratch Reader", I won't worry about it. They are a bunch of whiners themselves (James Dator, Jaxon and that whole group). This letter is a great effort in bringing up the truth. Good job. Its your turn now, Mr. Richardson.

Anonymous said...

All very nice. Except by being anonymous we have NO IDEA how many PSL owners this represents if ANY. That's the POINT of accountability. You people just don't get it.

Anonymous said...

I own a whole Row of PSL's, and although not part of this "group" they have my support, and their views represent my own for the most part. 17 Years is long enough to establish a winning program.

Kevin Mc said...

Do fans need to be accountable to their ad or do the Panthers need to be accountable to their fans? I love accountability but where is it on the part of the organization to the fans? I have no problem with folks remaining anonymous with their complaints, I do however have a problem with an owner that chooses to be anonymous at almost every turn. Whatever happened that he fired his own son's? What exactly are they looking for in terms of $'s for stadium upgrades? What upgrades? Are we going after a proven GM or someone on the rise, or maybe just a cheap candidate? The organization is not held accountable by the media, why should a few fans be accountable?

Why do folks post on here as anonymous?

Anonymous said...

I agree with EVERYTHING in the 1st letter/ad & this follow up.

Couldn't have said it better myself!!

Unknown said...

If people can't understand where these passionate fans like myself are coming from then they must not be from the area or they must enjoy mediocrity. This is also more than about wins and losses. The Panthers are tied to the name of our city and region. Its bigger than the NFL. We as a community are winners! The amount of success that the region has accomplished in the relatively short amount of time is unprecedented. If it wasn't for the passion of the community that brought the Panthers here and the can do attitude we would just be another average city that people just drive through to take a bathroom break. This response is for Michael Jordan too. Let me kill 2 birds with one stone.

Anonymous said...

I must agree with both the letter and email. I am a PSL Owner with 4 seats. I live in Charleston, SC. To Charlotte from Charleston is a 3 hr. drive. We normally arrive in Charlotte on Sat. get a hotel room and attend the games on Sunday. The Sunday drive back home has been miserable to say the least for many years now. My family and I are true Panther fans. We just want Mr. Richardson to put us a winning team together.

Frisco K Tank said...

Please shut up. You don't know anything about loyalty or being a fan because you STILL refuse to put a name to the complaints. I GUARANTEE you I pour more money into this team than you do, but you'll never hear me complain like this, because it's Ride or Die with this team. We'll get it turned around and REAL fans will be there to appreciate it.

Charlottean said...

You pay for entertainment. Entertainment is not directly tied to the success of the team. It can't be. Especially in a game that is so heavily influenced by injuries and can go either way "any given sunday".

Usually the best teams in baseball and basketball win the championship. Hockey too usually. Not necessarily the case in football. It's like college basketball. the team that's the hottest in the end wins it all.

The panthers are far from a franchise worth complaining about. Especially compared to the debacle that were the bobcats pre jordan takeover. THAT was embarrassing.

Be happy richardson brought the NFL here.

Anonymous said...

anonymous or not, the author's point is valid and should be considered. I am certain many more psl owners would agree, many more than the owners who sponsored the ad.

Anonymous said...

Wake up folks, that was from Marty Hurney!

Coleman said...

Scott: Over the last 18 seasons, where do the Panthers rank in overall winning percentage?

TP said...

Ok, so with all this back and forth I have a question - what is the purpose of this letter? We don't like losing? You should do a better job of running the team? We're mad as heck and aren't going to take it anymore? I don't get it.

You bring up the "business trade" example, but to what end? How do consumers have an effect on the business practices? If Disney makes a good movie every 6 or 7 years, and all the rest are crap do you spend a lot of money on an ad, tell them how bad their movies are and how the company is mismanaged, then proceed to proclaim how much you love them and are still going to support them? No, at some point you reach the breaking point and stop paying to see their bad films, because until you do there is no impetus for them to change. Oh no, you publicly called out a zillionaire! I'm sure that will make him change. If he is really such a greedy guy and cares nothing about winning or the fans, why would he react to your letter? The logic here is very flawed.

If you really believe all that you write, then how can you in good conscience continue to support this man with your money? All you have done is choose a very expensive way to vent. If you are firm in your beliefs and want to bring about real change the only option is to stop buying the season tickets. Of course, then you would be able to jump back on the bandwagon when times are good, so there's that to consider.

Sounds to me like the real complaint is that you feel forced to by tickets when the team is not winning (you agreed to this when you signed the PSL contract). We have a term for that - fair-weather fans.

Anonymous said...

Jerry is silent while Michael Jordan has come in and met with Season ticket holders. Usually twice a year. Answers questions on the teams website. Not too mention has been clear about what he is trying to do with draft picks and the salary cap. He may not be winning, but at least I feel like I know what he is trying to do. Makes me feel better about where I am spedning my money.

Anonymous said...

I am a loyal fan and would love to see the team play better, but I do not believe our record is the only issue. I went to Atlanta this year to see the team play. The atmosphere in Atlanta is very different. At every stoppage of play there is something going on to get the fans involved. Local celebreties are ono the big screen leading cheers. The seats are full and the fans are involved. An effort to keep the fans in the game could make a difference on the turn out and the results.

Anonymous said...

It's a bunch of LA businessmen who want to stir the pot in hopes of gaining a franchise.

Anonymous said...

I Thought the first ad was a direct hit and this one continues to drive home the point.

Ron Rivera is the only the point the only point I have mixed feelings. He is probably one of the few coaches that have been brought to a team that didn't get to put it together the way he saw fit. Rivera's coaching tenure here begun strapped with 3 running backs that were all unmoveable because of high salaries.

Include an owner that's more interested in keeping an ineffective friend (Marty Hurney) in positions of power instead of running a team like a business and that makes any coaches ability to succeed difficult at best.

Although, I think Rivera has improved, it's time to look and invest in a big name coach. The Panthers have a feature QB and Richardson has failed to put the pieces around him to succeed.

The ad isn't about whining. If anything this piece just highlights some of the many failings at the top. This team will only be as good as the leadership allows it to be and thus far this ad and the follow up highlight the lack of responsibility at the ownership level.

Completely agree with perturbed Panthers fan

Anonymous said...

There are 19 other teams who arent gonna be in the playoffs this year, either. 30 other teams wont win a Superbowl, either. There's no magic formula. Nobody forced these anonymous clowns to purchase PSLs - I dont wanna hear all their griping and whining. Sell your seats.

Anonymous said...

In all professional sports of the last 10 years there is only one team that has not had back to back winning seasons, guess who, Carolina Panthers. I am a PSL owner, I go to all but one home game every year, I have never left a game early I stay till the clock goes to 00.00. The silence from the ownership over the years gives us nothing but to think they don't care. The last 2 years of Fox was nothing more than letting his contract run out, everybody knew that. Is that caring about wining or about money? We have never had an offensive head coach, always defensive. Hurney should have went with Fox 4 years ago. Ownership should clean house, bring in a aggressive GM, go after a great minded offensive head coach, like Sean Payton he's in play lets bring him here instead of letting him go to Dallas.

Anonymous said...

There is no whining in the letter. The open letter actually speaks the frustration many loyal fans feel. Besides, no one has addressed the timing of the letter. Which I think is good. The Panthers will ask for more money from the city to make improvements to the stadium. If the city, thus the taxpayers, are going to foot the bill there should be a sense of Mr. Richardson wanting to do his part in getting the best players and coaches. Thus far we have not done that in the coaching area. Once again, the taxpayer will be stuck with a bill on a team in which the product stinks.

Santa's Helper said...

Have a very Merry XMAS...it's the best time of the year...All of your Panther's hopes will be dashed by Dec. 25th. THAT will certainly be clear.

La ta da di da di da da....

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 2:16 :

So we should have fired Fox 2 years earlier, huh? I guess that means he should have been fired coming off of a 12-4 season, 8-0 at home (2008). Ok. I guess it was his fault Jake imploded in the playoff game against AZ.

Now you're a REAL FAN!

Anonymous said...

Anon 1:26, I moved to the metro Atlanta area and attended the meltdown at the Georgia Dome. Their fans are not more engaged. The stadium experience may be better on their big screen but the crowd is not. Samuel L Jackson is not a local celebrity he's from DC and was just paid to do a spot. As for the letter what difference does it make if they signed their names or not. A lot of fans want some improvement. How the GM search goes will be telling.

TP said...

"In all professional sports of the last 10 years there is only one team that has not had back to back winning seasons, guess who, Carolina Panthers."

Yikes. Let's just start making stuff up why don't we. REALLY??

Do I need to break out a list? This is just a lie.

Look, I know everybody wants the team to win, and I don't think anybody here really disagrees with that. Everybody has their own idea about what the Panthers should do - who should be the coach, and who they should sign/draft, but nobody really answers the question about what this letter really hopes to accomplish. People right "Richardson needs to be held accountable" - by who? And how? By wasting a bunch of money on an ad? Someone please explain how that holds him accountable any more than this comment section. More people see it? Whoopee. If you are still writing that check for next year's tickets all this noise means squat. Not to mention, like it or not JR is NOT accountable to you. PSL holders ARE NOT shareholders. He is going to do as HE sees fit with HIS team. Deal with it or don't - your choice. You don't have to be happy about it, but throwing a bunch of money at an ad that complains about how wisely the Panthers spend their money is a joke. Irony anyone?

Anonymous said...

The game environment is so much better at the Georgia Dome that Blank is doing all he can to get the city to build him a new stadium. Based on all of their success. RIIIIGHT. Hilarious.

Anonymous said...

i don't get it. it could be much worse. look at detroit, clevland and until recently, new orleans.
with the exception of the recent saints, those teams would love to have the track record we have. the panthers are 18 years old, been to one super bowl, 2 nfc championship games and the playoffs all in that span. i think some folks got spoiled early. yes i would like to win consistantly but it doesnt work like that in the NFL. it took new england a long, long time to get that superbowl win. all the pieces need to fall in place. we are still looking for those pieces. i do not think it is an ownership thing. i think it is a general manager thing. richardson has expressed his dipleasure with losing, he just writes the checks he does not pick the pieces. i get upset when i read this stuff,because i have been a true fan since their birth. have only missed watching one or 2 games in 18 years. i can assure you , and my wife will agree, that if i lived closer to charlotte, that i would own seats and be there win or lose every sunday. wins can't be bought, they are earned. fix a few things and this all goes away. it has to be said that ignoring a vet reciever to play along smith is a huge mistake as well as our awful offensive line. once the new gm gets in and fixes these issues we will be fine. you rich,wine and cheese fans just sell your seats to us real fans. the ones that are behind the team win or lose. go buy seats in cleveland and tell me how much better things are over there!!

Anonymous said...

I don't think this is the same as the people who took out the Perturbed Panthers ad in the paper, this is much better written, I wish it had been in the paper.

Anonymous said...

BREAKING NEWS! TEAM NOT VERY GOOD - FANS NOT HAPPY!

EGADS! Who ever heard of such a thing???

Of course all of the fans want the team to win. We just can't all afford to pay a small fortune to post it all over the newspaper. If you really think that JR doesn't care if the team wins then you are a fool. There is a difference in not caring and just not being able to make it happen. As if all that has to happen is for him to want it. What is he supposed to do, poll the PSL owners to find out who he should hire? That might be difficult, because (as is clear from these comments) there are about a million different ideas about what needs to happen. I get so sick of hearing about how he blew the team up before 2009. Yes, they cut a bunch of vets and replaced them with young, cheap talent. Other than Kasay (40+ kicker) and Hoover (broken down at the end of his career), can you name an impact player he let go? The window was already closed on that team, and he went cheap because he knew the lockout was coming. He wasn't going to sign a bunch of high priced free agents anyway. Any team that does that is just asking for trouble. The FO made some stupid decisions in the draft, and they ended up paying too many guys that play the same position after the lockout. Again, bad personnel moves are not the same as not caring. Hurney is gone. There will be a GM in place that hopefully makes good draft choices. If you are holding your breath for a bunch of free agent big names, you might as well just let it go. It won't happen, and it shouldn't. That's not how you win. And as for a "big name coach", who exactly would that be? Gruden? Cowher? Payton? Some unproven college coach? What guarantee do you have that these guys will win? Gruden was "meh" in TB after the first year with Dungy's guys. Cowher won one SB in Pittsburgh in 10 or so tries (with a team that should have won more). Payton isn't coming here. He'll either stay in NO or go to Dallas. Sure if you can get him that's great, but Brees isn't coming with him. It's always greener on the other side.

Mike said...

Talk about completely clueless and misguided.

No, you do not represent "TRUE PANTHERS FANS EVERYWHERE". You represent whiny Panthers fans everywhere. Tell those of us who went to the game in San Diego that there wasn't a good product on the field. And there were a LOT of us there.

Anonymous said...

I have a real problem with people calling these guys whiners. Especially the guy ("Real Fan") who tries to make a case that we should be grateful for a franchise because there are so many other franchises that have been worse. These PSL owners consistently dump money into this franchise BECAUSE they renew their tickets EVERY year. They have a RIGHT to express their opinion. In order to foster a strong fan base, you have to post consistent winning seasons. ALL....and I say again, ALL NFL franchises are going to make money, and lots of it. Look at the list of the most valuable sports franchises in the world and you will see that all 32 NFL teams are in the top 50. The argument, as the writer of this article pointed out, isn't about money, it's about a roadmap to improvement. Yes, Mr Richardson got involved and fired Hurney, but that was long overdue and I don't think anyone will disagree there. Mr Richardson recognized that and fired the GM. The facts are simple: Hurney was terrible at mid-round draft talent evaluation and we were very rarely players in the Free Agency market. Topped by a team full of bad contracts, the receipe for success starts with this hire of a new GM and his ability to get the salaries under control. We have a young talent base and certainly capable of big things, but one fact that people are overlooking is that we had too high of expectations this year based on last year's success and Kalil's ad in the preseason. This team has WAAAAAY too many holes to fill to be a contender year in and year out (OL and DB/Safeties for starters). I, for one, do have faith in Mr Richardson, but this organization, the fans AND the local media have to be patient as this team evolves. Throwing money at the problem isn't always the answer (see the ridiculous amount of spending last off season). If your philosophy is to "build through the draft," you first have to draft well. I'm sorry, drafting an obscure offensive lineman from a D-II school is a perfect example of why our draft picks beyond the first round typically don't pan out. I don't think anyone in this forum, Scott or any of the other writers for the C.O. could make a case for too many other teams that draft worse than we do. In addition to not being players in FA, you have the formula that produces the outcome we have out on the field now. Do I believe the learning curve for Rivera is nearly vertical? Yes. Do I think he can do the job? Yes. Do I think he's made a bunch of coaching mistakes along the way? Absolutely, but who, of the best coaches in the NFL, hasn't? The most important move the Panthers will make in this offseason will be who they hire as GM. Period. That's part of the reason why Mr. Richardson hired an outside firm to help. The new GM will have to be VERY active in renegotiating contracts JUST to get under the salary cap, not to mention signing our draft picks. Needless to say, whoever they hire will have to hit the ground running right away! My advice to Rivera, though, is take charge of what works. A high-octane offense worked last season. Had the defense not been horrible, we MIGHT have been in the playoffs in Rivera's first year, but it's hard to fix a 2-14 team overnight. The offense is showing signs of life that were similar to last year now, and the defense is making great strides now too. This off seasons personnel moves will be CRITICAL to our success next year, but I agree that if we don't make the playoffs next year, blow up the team and start over. As for the fans, we all support the team, but we just have a hard time dealing with the frustrations of losing. The PSL owners made a statement to management. Support it, because in the end, we'll all be the same people filling the seats in BoA Stadium on Sundays and we all want the same thing....a championship caliber franchise!

Bob (PSL owner) said...

Richardson won't fire Rivera as he has too many years left on his contract. He's not going to pay two coaches.

Anonymous said...

People are morons for putting so much into a professional sports team.

So what if the team sux?

Only a fool would have so much vested in sports.

Anonymous said...

apparently it hasn't been a good season for making a profit selling psl seats to the opposing teams fans.

Anonymous said...

Don't let it, sell your seats. Otherwise, shut up.

Anonymous said...

Well... they sure speak for me and I did sell my (4)PSL's and the Panthers did lose an active fan who along with my family attended most every game in Charlotte and only missed one game in Clemson. And by the way the six seasons we drove 5 hours to Charlotte and since then two hours drive to Charlotte. I gets expensive travelling so to watch this often noncompetitive nonsense. I couldn't take it anymore, I have enough to worry about in a management job that I enjoy to get flippin' bummed out a majority of the Sundays from gametime untill. Do I still watch the Panthers? Sure, most Sundays I do, but every single home game I look at those empty seats and in a strangly satisfying way four of those empty seats represent me. Go Broncos!

Stephen said...

I agree with the tone of the PSL owner's letter. I do think Rivera should be given one more year. But I moved to Indiana in 2007 and have remained a loyal Panther's fan for 5 years. I had to fork out plenty of cash to watch their games on Sunday Ticket. I've purchased merch. The day of games I wear my Smitty or Newton jersey to work, and all my Hoosier co-workers know I'm a big Panther's fan. When a nationally televised comes on here, I'm sure to let everyone know. But every time the Panthers embarrass me, such as that debacle against New York this year. They've had 1 winning season since I've moved here. And I have to put up with all the ribbing text I receive from Colts fan whose team has a winning record with their rookie QB. I just want a respectable team. But I'll always be a Panthers fan, no matter what...

Anonymous said...

Why doesn't Mr. Richardson have an invite for the loyal paying fans to come in and ask questions? What's he afraid of? Educate and communicate with the people who are paying the salaries of the players and making Mr. Richardson a wealthy owner. Most companies have shareholder meetings, if you have a PSL your a shareholder of the franchise. Come to the table and have a discussion with passionate fans. At the end of the day we all want to win a superbowl right?

Anonymous said...

I find it interesting the letter/email referenceds the media's "approval" of the Panthers' record. Where's the surprise? The Observer staff has always been more interested in telling its readers the UNC-Chapel Hill Tar Heels is the team everyone should be a fan of. I wonder how much free marketing the Observer has provided UNC-Chapel Hill.

Anonymous said...

All BS... in any sport there are dues to pay. Going to one Superbowl is not guaranteed. We have already had a shot. Real fans stick by their teams, these aren't real fans or real men. Stop whining and go home and watch your 'out of state' teams. Big baby whiners who apparently make so much money they think they own other businesses and have the right to manage them via the media. Get a real life, its a SPORT, nothing more.

A Real Fan said...

To Anon at 4pm -
I don't really understand how you can support the article but disagree with nearly everything in it. You agree things are headed in the right direction. You believe that Mr. Richardson wants the team to succeed. Mistakes have been made. People have lost their jobs for these mistakes. Rivera is getting better and developing talent. All of these things are in opposition to the letter you claim to support. Also, you state that the letter writer opines that this is not about money but results, when he expressly states that he can come up with no explanation for the problems other than money. I disagree with the writer, and it seems you do too. I stand by my opinion that the writers come off as arrogant and entitled - not by wanting the team to win, but by the intimation that since they are not it must mean that the owner doesn't care (or cares more about money). I don't question anyone's right to express an opinion. These comment sections, various forums, and other venues provide ample opportunity to do so. I feel that one does not commit the resources to a full page ad in the newspaper to simply express an opinion. I understand that you do not share that opinion and respect that, but it seems what you believe is much more in line with what I wrote than the "Perturbed PSL" writer.

One question:
If the current progress continues, Rivera is retained and the team makes the playoffs next year, what will have changed in ownership and management that has not already happened prior to the writing of this letter? Will the writers still complain about the direction, or celebrate the success of the team? I don't really understand either scenario - if they still complain then I would be interested to hear the grounds for this, as a winning team and good product is what they are asking for. If they do not complain, what was done differently as a result of their grievances? What if Rivera loses his job and we get the big name coach, new GM, and still don't make the playoffs? There is no guarantee, and the attitude that this is any type of certainty and Mr. Richardson is just not willing to commit the necessary resources is naive at best and insufferably arrogant at worst.

Anonymous said...

Bob (PSL Owner)

Based on what? Your close relationship with Mr. Richardson? He fired Capers and Seifert with time remaining on their deals. He let Fox coach out the string for various reasons, including impending lockout, the maddeningly up and down nature of the team from season to season under Fox, too much loyalty to Hurney, and the good play at the end of the 2009 season. It's not as if he just didn't want to pay two coaches.

Anonymous said...

In the NFL we have a salary cap, not in the business world. Teams do not build winners by getting rid of coach after coach. I am also frustrated, but at least this coach (unlike john fox who is winning) is willing to make changes.

Anonymous said...

So what is gained here? Angry fan vers the hopeful. In non of this will anyone of us change influence or pressure another outcome other then what the team has already or will soon decide. All we can do is hope for the best. Sometimes the best will not be good enough for most people. These ones will never no the true satisfaction that comes from true owenship. Ownership is more then the power to buy. Ownership is loyalty. Ownership is also a commitment. While I have not purchased this team, they are dear to my hart. They after all, are MY Panthers. I love them and sometimes I hate that I love them. But ether way ... Revara or no.. I have chosen this team for a reason. And I will stick with them. Mr. Richardson I doubt you will read this but if you do please no that we are behind you, and hope for next year. Everyone I hope you enjoy the playoffs the draft and spring practice. We have so meeny serous things to worry about ... Try to enjoy football ... That's why it exist in the first place.

Anonymous said...

Simple answer: Sell your PSLs, quit watching the games on TV, don't buy Panther merchandise, etc.

That's exactly what I did. Went back to the team I pulled for before the Panthers came to Charlotte, the Bears.

Jerry still gets rich, but he gets rich off YOU, and not me.

Go Bears.

Anonymous said...

Whoever these people are, Id like to take them out to a steak dinner! Bravo my friends! Im guessing that greedy hillbilly Jerry didnt take too kind to being called out publically. And those who ripped the ad are just blind homers who think their team can do no wrong.

Anonymous said...

No way the person who wrote that email also wrote the ad. Compare syntax and style.

Anonymous said...

Always amazes me how smart some think they are. Why is this a big deal now and why does it take some random letter to provoke it?

Fans have a vote and can deliver a much louder message to Mr.Richarson. Simply don't go to the games. Law of supply/demand applies here folks. Fans keep feeding the monster. And have continued over the years as prices of tickets and concessions have escalated.

It is almost assured that if fans stop going to games, you will see a quick response.

Fans have just as much a sense of entitlement as Mr. Richardson. At the end of the day everyone has a choice. Use your pocket book if you want it to change. Mr. Richardson is smart, he will not stand point if cash flow starts to slow down.

Probably will not happen as most that go to games now use it as a social status to be at the games.

For me, I sold my PSL's about 5 years ago and am doing great. I want the Panthers to do well. If not, well there are more important areas to expend my energy and resources.

Ken Rice said...

11123I am in basic agreement with the complaints expressed in the full page ad in Mondays Observer. When an NFL team is not able to put together a single back to back winning season in 18 years, their is a serious systemic problem. The system is broken folks. It really is that simple.
Where do you start looking to fix the problem? You look at the Owner? I don't profess to know the solution, but it is the job of Jerry Richardson to solve that problem. He has done a miserable job of doing that so far, but maybe firing Marty Hurney and hiring a consultant to find the next GM is a start in the right direction.
I like what I am seeing down the stretch, and I would like to see Rivera stay another season, because I think they may be turning things around. However, the real proof of an organization going in the right direction will be sustaining a winning program, and they have not been able to do that in the past.

Ken Rice

James Dator said...

Hunkydory,
Terribly sorry you're angry old chap. I think you'll find we're not 'whiners' over at Cat Scratch Reader, but rather a group of fans who better understand that successful franchises aren't built in a day, let alone the second year into a new QB and head coach's tenure.

The letter and argument were pertinent back in 2010, but in December of 2012 it's unnecessary. Hurney is gone, Accorsi is searching for a new GM, Newton is developing, and this coaching staff have finally learned from their mistakes (of which there were many).

In short: The wholesale changes requested are underway already, whether or not fans are impatient is another story.

Thanks for reading our site though!

Anonymous said...

I agree with the intent of the ad but NOT their conjecture, that it is greed that has caused the mediocrity. The Patriots have spent almost $2 million LESS than the Panthers, & who wouldn't love their consistent record.
It all comes down to management & coaches decisions. Richardson is not successful because he is greedy, he's wealthy because he has the acumen & drive not common amongst men.

Douglas Pauly said...

I'm glad to see efforts like this to hold ALL involved with the team accountable. I can take losing, though I absolutely hate it, so long as I'm convinced that winning is THE goal of the ownership I fork so much money over to each and every year. THAT is the rub.

Anonymous said...

I agree 100%. I'm glad someone did this. I'm just as upset as the author of the letter. Time for Jerry to be accountable. Spend some freaking money on quality talent. And my names Danny Hill

Joe ross said...

22Why should anyone take an anomyous letter seriously??? Put your on it and own your statement! Joe Ross, PSL owner

Anonymous said...

It was mentioned in an earlier post about the long time it took the New England Patriots to become successful. It begins with the owner. Robert Kraft bought the Patriots in 1994. Before that time they were a perennial losing team. Prior to his purchase of the team, the Patriots were 19-61. Since he purchased the team in 1994, the Patriots have won 11 division titles, 6 conference titles and 3 Super Bowl championships.

I saw the reverse happen to the Washington Redskins. When Jack Kent Cooke owned the team, the Redskins were perennial winners. Since Daniel Snyder bought the team..well the Redskins record speaks for itself.

I'm sorry, the success of a sports franchise doesn't start with the head coach or even the general manager. It begins at the very top...THE OWNER. The Owner's mindset and philosophy will affect every decision that is made...hirings of head coaches and general managers, how much to pay for players, developing the team through the draft, free agency or a combination of the two, whether to trade draft picks or keep them, etc....

It is the owner of the franchise that sets the compass of that franchise.

So, the key question is what type of owner is Mr. Richardson. If a franchise has continuity in ownership and continued, perennial, historic mediocrity, then the problem has been discovered. The only problem is, you can fire players, coaches and general managers, but you can't fire owners. That owner must decide for himself or herself, change or let the team go.

Otherwise, like has been said, the definition of insanity is to do the things you've always done, but expect a different result.

Anonymous said...

It all comes down to the players. Let me take away 3 fumbles and 3 interceptions and we are 10 game winners...easy. I think Mr. Richardson is dedicated and has spent the money but its up to the players to win the games. I say give Coach R 1 more season but if no playoffs....he goes.

Christopher Santiago said...

I blame coaching. Coaches know who to keep and who to let go. Just look at what Jim H. did with his 49ers in such a short amount of time. To me it's all about the coaches. We can blame players for this or for that but it's the coaches who decides who get's involved in what plays and on how many plays. I could go on and on about who to lay blame but to me at the end of the day it comes down to the coaches in knowing what they have and how they should use them.